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	<title>Comments on: Reflections From an Engineer on Advocacy for Transportation Reform</title>
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	<link>http://www.pps.org/blog/reflections-from-an-engineer-on-advocacy-for-transportation-reform/</link>
	<description>Placemaking for Communities</description>
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		<title>By: ewastud</title>
		<link>http://www.pps.org/blog/reflections-from-an-engineer-on-advocacy-for-transportation-reform/comment-page-1/#comment-97792</link>
		<dc:creator>ewastud</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 Jan 2013 21:39:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pps.org/?p=79791#comment-97792</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I did not attend the PWPB conference, but I am a veteran civil servant and city planner who has heard many criticisms at public meetings regarding the actions/inactions and policies of the city in which I work, and even of my profession.  However harsh or crudely stated, I don&#039;t take such criticisms personally and feel the need to be defensive as Bryan does.  To be so defensive and sensitive as that seems pretty silly to me.  Speaking from experience, most often, such criticisms and attacks, even if sometimes misplaced, have a good deal of merit.  

We should accept the criticisms and use them constructively to agitate for change within our organizations and to educate and prod decision makers to make decisions that are truly in the best interest of the public rather than the most politically expedient decisions that satisfy perhaps certain special interest groups with a vested financial stake.  

Irrespective of whatever good work that Bryan has personally been responsible for, the fact is that transportation engineers and planners have been largely dominated by the oil-automobile-highway construction lobby whose money really talks.  Generally speaking (now and historically), the transportation professionals have had very closed minds to other interests and concerns besides that aggressively influential (and very corrupt) lobby.  I find a great many engineers who have a very conservative mindset that only regards the established construction standards as valid for designing facilities, and has never considered re-looking at the basis of these &quot;standards&quot; and how well they actual serve all members of society.

Look, for instance, at the bitter opposition of transportation professionals and municipal officials across America to the implementation of curb ramps and other design refinements needed for handicapped accessibility.  It took a protracted legal fight to finally make curb ramps ubiquitous across the country.  Unfortunately, all too often, only well-funded lawsuits make many transportation officials &quot;get it.&quot;  Curb ramps have not only been narrowly beneficial to persons in wheelchairs, but also parents pushing their children in strollers, delivery people and movers with hand trucks, as well as many other less ambulatory persons in the community.  

Also, most importantly, we need to stop looking at the world only within the narrow confines of the boxes in which we categorize things.  We need to see the big picture, not just &quot;transportation&quot; as an end it itself.  Decisions made concerning the design of streets are not divorced from such concerns as global warming and pollution of our streams and oceans, for the design of streets impact them both.  The more we pave over the land with concrete and asphalt, the greater is the urban heat island effect and the more storm water carrying sediments and other pollutants is collected that needs to be dealt with.  We need to minimize the amount of pavement to what is really necessary.  

The street infrastructure carrying motor vehicles should be decoupled from that carrying pedestrians and bicyclists.  There is no reason except close minded thinking causing us to put these together always within the same public right-of-way.  There is also little reason for the vehicular network from crossing paths with pedestrians and bicycles.  Through the intelligent use of dead-end streets and grade separation, especially where the terrain is to our advantage, we can design networks in which pedestrians and bicyclists can travel long, continuous paths without ever encountering an automobile.   We don&#039;t have to re-invent the wheel even.  These solutions have already been employed successfully (such as the Greenbelt towns, and at Village Homes in Davis, California) before the transportation and planning professions seemed to forget about them.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I did not attend the PWPB conference, but I am a veteran civil servant and city planner who has heard many criticisms at public meetings regarding the actions/inactions and policies of the city in which I work, and even of my profession.  However harsh or crudely stated, I don&#8217;t take such criticisms personally and feel the need to be defensive as Bryan does.  To be so defensive and sensitive as that seems pretty silly to me.  Speaking from experience, most often, such criticisms and attacks, even if sometimes misplaced, have a good deal of merit.  </p>
<p>We should accept the criticisms and use them constructively to agitate for change within our organizations and to educate and prod decision makers to make decisions that are truly in the best interest of the public rather than the most politically expedient decisions that satisfy perhaps certain special interest groups with a vested financial stake.  </p>
<p>Irrespective of whatever good work that Bryan has personally been responsible for, the fact is that transportation engineers and planners have been largely dominated by the oil-automobile-highway construction lobby whose money really talks.  Generally speaking (now and historically), the transportation professionals have had very closed minds to other interests and concerns besides that aggressively influential (and very corrupt) lobby.  I find a great many engineers who have a very conservative mindset that only regards the established construction standards as valid for designing facilities, and has never considered re-looking at the basis of these &#8220;standards&#8221; and how well they actual serve all members of society.</p>
<p>Look, for instance, at the bitter opposition of transportation professionals and municipal officials across America to the implementation of curb ramps and other design refinements needed for handicapped accessibility.  It took a protracted legal fight to finally make curb ramps ubiquitous across the country.  Unfortunately, all too often, only well-funded lawsuits make many transportation officials &#8220;get it.&#8221;  Curb ramps have not only been narrowly beneficial to persons in wheelchairs, but also parents pushing their children in strollers, delivery people and movers with hand trucks, as well as many other less ambulatory persons in the community.  </p>
<p>Also, most importantly, we need to stop looking at the world only within the narrow confines of the boxes in which we categorize things.  We need to see the big picture, not just &#8220;transportation&#8221; as an end it itself.  Decisions made concerning the design of streets are not divorced from such concerns as global warming and pollution of our streams and oceans, for the design of streets impact them both.  The more we pave over the land with concrete and asphalt, the greater is the urban heat island effect and the more storm water carrying sediments and other pollutants is collected that needs to be dealt with.  We need to minimize the amount of pavement to what is really necessary.  </p>
<p>The street infrastructure carrying motor vehicles should be decoupled from that carrying pedestrians and bicyclists.  There is no reason except close minded thinking causing us to put these together always within the same public right-of-way.  There is also little reason for the vehicular network from crossing paths with pedestrians and bicycles.  Through the intelligent use of dead-end streets and grade separation, especially where the terrain is to our advantage, we can design networks in which pedestrians and bicyclists can travel long, continuous paths without ever encountering an automobile.   We don&#8217;t have to re-invent the wheel even.  These solutions have already been employed successfully (such as the Greenbelt towns, and at Village Homes in Davis, California) before the transportation and planning professions seemed to forget about them.</p>
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		<title>By: &#8220;We Are the Majority! The Cars Don&#8217;t Vote!&#8221; &#124; Project for Public Spaces</title>
		<link>http://www.pps.org/blog/reflections-from-an-engineer-on-advocacy-for-transportation-reform/comment-page-1/#comment-97675</link>
		<dc:creator>&#8220;We Are the Majority! The Cars Don&#8217;t Vote!&#8221; &#124; Project for Public Spaces</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Nov 2012 17:57:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pps.org/?p=79791#comment-97675</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] does this speech get you fired up? Or could it contribute to engineering bashing as described by Bryan Jones? Or both? Sound off in the comments below!     Related [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] does this speech get you fired up? Or could it contribute to engineering bashing as described by Bryan Jones? Or both? Sound off in the comments below!     Related [...]</p>
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		<title>By: guest</title>
		<link>http://www.pps.org/blog/reflections-from-an-engineer-on-advocacy-for-transportation-reform/comment-page-1/#comment-97660</link>
		<dc:creator>guest</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Nov 2012 03:06:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pps.org/?p=79791#comment-97660</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Wow dylanrivis before attacking Bryan because of his position as a transportation engineer/ planner or his qualifications (acronyms behind his name) I would encourage you to google what he has already done for bicyclists and pedestrians and what he continues to do for us. His accomplishments and experiences speak volumes and maybe we as advocates can learn from his ability to facilitate and lead change within local governments. Bryan is headed in the right direction and as advocates we should be supporting people in positions like Bryan&#039;s that can help us actually make change occur. And maybe by working with people like Bryan that &quot;Get It&quot; we can demonstrate change through implementation and others in the engineering, planning, and elected official professions will follow. It is people in the public that attack government officials that make them risk adverse and less susceptable to change or innovation.

I think you missed Bryan&#039;s entire point. He was not saying that your feelings do not matter. Rather he was saying bringing anger and emotion to the table and attacking people has accomplished very little for those on the advocacy side that utilize that approach. And maybe we should be listening to him to identify strategic ways that actually work within our local governments to facilitate change and be heard. We are all part of the solution. Raising your voice or attacking others does not establish an equal footing. Treating people with respect and working to create a relationship with the person will often result in an equal footing and actually having some credibility to be heard. 

Bryan was recently appointed to the State of California Traffic Control Devices Committee, which oversees the CA MUTCD changes, as one of two new voting members representing bicycists and pedestrians of all ages and abilities. This is how new active transportation treatments that enhance the environment for bicyclists and pedestrians are approved. The California Department of Transportation (Caltrans) working with the California Bicycle Coalition created these two new voting positions. 

Here are just some videos from both Fresno and Carlsbad that I easily found on the web.

Carlsbad Livable Streets Youtube video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AS9VFpVWTB8 
Carlsbad Pedestrian Scramble Youtube Video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fvDpk7J2zY8&amp;list=UUEpvrViEk8vH3AzLg5lEo8A&amp;index=8&amp;feature=plcp I BIKE FRESNO Biking = Joyhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&amp;v=keeDi-2KUg0I BIKE FRESNO Revive your Bikehttp://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&amp;v=cZuem_B-L2sI BIKE FRESNO May is Bike Month Sponsorship videohttp://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&amp;v=ohQfVJQ9a9A]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wow dylanrivis before attacking Bryan because of his position as a transportation engineer/ planner or his qualifications (acronyms behind his name) I would encourage you to google what he has already done for bicyclists and pedestrians and what he continues to do for us. His accomplishments and experiences speak volumes and maybe we as advocates can learn from his ability to facilitate and lead change within local governments. Bryan is headed in the right direction and as advocates we should be supporting people in positions like Bryan&#8217;s that can help us actually make change occur. And maybe by working with people like Bryan that &#8220;Get It&#8221; we can demonstrate change through implementation and others in the engineering, planning, and elected official professions will follow. It is people in the public that attack government officials that make them risk adverse and less susceptable to change or innovation.</p>
<p>I think you missed Bryan&#8217;s entire point. He was not saying that your feelings do not matter. Rather he was saying bringing anger and emotion to the table and attacking people has accomplished very little for those on the advocacy side that utilize that approach. And maybe we should be listening to him to identify strategic ways that actually work within our local governments to facilitate change and be heard. We are all part of the solution. Raising your voice or attacking others does not establish an equal footing. Treating people with respect and working to create a relationship with the person will often result in an equal footing and actually having some credibility to be heard. </p>
<p>Bryan was recently appointed to the State of California Traffic Control Devices Committee, which oversees the CA MUTCD changes, as one of two new voting members representing bicycists and pedestrians of all ages and abilities. This is how new active transportation treatments that enhance the environment for bicyclists and pedestrians are approved. The California Department of Transportation (Caltrans) working with the California Bicycle Coalition created these two new voting positions. </p>
<p>Here are just some videos from both Fresno and Carlsbad that I easily found on the web.</p>
<p>Carlsbad Livable Streets Youtube video <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AS9VFpVWTB8" rel="nofollow">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AS9VFpVWTB8</a><br />
Carlsbad Pedestrian Scramble Youtube Video <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fvDpk7J2zY8&#038;list=UUEpvrViEk8vH3AzLg5lEo8A&#038;index=8&#038;feature=plcp" rel="nofollow">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fvDpk7J2zY8&#038;list=UUEpvrViEk8vH3AzLg5lEo8A&#038;index=8&#038;feature=plcp</a> I BIKE FRESNO Biking = Joyhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&amp;v=keeDi-2KUg0I BIKE FRESNO Revive your Bikehttp://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&amp;v=cZuem_B-L2sI BIKE FRESNO May is Bike Month Sponsorship videohttp://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&amp;v=ohQfVJQ9a9A</p>
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		<title>By: Guest</title>
		<link>http://www.pps.org/blog/reflections-from-an-engineer-on-advocacy-for-transportation-reform/comment-page-1/#comment-97646</link>
		<dc:creator>Guest</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Nov 2012 23:48:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pps.org/?p=79791#comment-97646</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Bruce, regarding the comment about anger not doing much good, I would say it depends - Is dylanrivis an attorney or friends with an attorney?  Sometimes, as engineers, when we fail to hear the issues behind the anger, these things play out in the court instead of in our meetings like they should - no?  Surely as an engineer you have had this experience.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bruce, regarding the comment about anger not doing much good, I would say it depends &#8211; Is dylanrivis an attorney or friends with an attorney?  Sometimes, as engineers, when we fail to hear the issues behind the anger, these things play out in the court instead of in our meetings like they should &#8211; no?  Surely as an engineer you have had this experience.</p>
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		<title>By: Bruce Lierman</title>
		<link>http://www.pps.org/blog/reflections-from-an-engineer-on-advocacy-for-transportation-reform/comment-page-1/#comment-97637</link>
		<dc:creator>Bruce Lierman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 06 Nov 2012 23:27:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pps.org/?p=79791#comment-97637</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[

Your last sentence indicates to me the difficulty of working with you as a force for change for cycling or any other issue.  You are at the table.  Being a cyclist does not grant you any special rights as a citizen, and certainly, neither does your anger.  Your anger is yours.  There is no reason to expect any elected official or other public figure to respond to it.  If you want to influence those who make decisions in a democracy, build a constituency and advocate for change.  It will happen at the ballot box, by the action of a respectfully vocal and well-supported group of advocates.  

The public facilities we have are a manifestation of the multiple opinions and concepts represented in our body politic.  There are plenty of angry  people.  Some of them ride bicycles. Some of them drive pickup trucks.  No matter what the benefits of any particular mode of transportation or energy production may exist in the minds of individuals,  the only way to make those benefits manifest in public works is to convince the majority of voters that they are in their best interest.  All the rest, all the posturing, all the outrage, serve only the self-image of the individuals expressing them. 

Our choices are to enter the public arena and make the best deal we can, or to go it alone and work what change we can by ourselves or with a cadre of like-minded individuals outside of the public, political arena.  Take your pick.  Except for your own motivation, I don&#039;t think you&#039;ll find your anger will do you much good in either venue.



Bruce Lierman]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Your last sentence indicates to me the difficulty of working with you as a force for change for cycling or any other issue.  You are at the table.  Being a cyclist does not grant you any special rights as a citizen, and certainly, neither does your anger.  Your anger is yours.  There is no reason to expect any elected official or other public figure to respond to it.  If you want to influence those who make decisions in a democracy, build a constituency and advocate for change.  It will happen at the ballot box, by the action of a respectfully vocal and well-supported group of advocates.  </p>
<p>The public facilities we have are a manifestation of the multiple opinions and concepts represented in our body politic.  There are plenty of angry  people.  Some of them ride bicycles. Some of them drive pickup trucks.  No matter what the benefits of any particular mode of transportation or energy production may exist in the minds of individuals,  the only way to make those benefits manifest in public works is to convince the majority of voters that they are in their best interest.  All the rest, all the posturing, all the outrage, serve only the self-image of the individuals expressing them. </p>
<p>Our choices are to enter the public arena and make the best deal we can, or to go it alone and work what change we can by ourselves or with a cadre of like-minded individuals outside of the public, political arena.  Take your pick.  Except for your own motivation, I don&#8217;t think you&#8217;ll find your anger will do you much good in either venue.</p>
<p>Bruce Lierman</p>
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		<title>By: dylanrivis</title>
		<link>http://www.pps.org/blog/reflections-from-an-engineer-on-advocacy-for-transportation-reform/comment-page-1/#comment-97633</link>
		<dc:creator>dylanrivis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 04 Nov 2012 16:20:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pps.org/?p=79791#comment-97633</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[As a cyclist who has seen how fellow bicycling humans are accomodated in countries such as Holland and Germany and compared that to the dismal, typically myopic, North American approach have a long established reservoir of anger. So you will have to endure my and others&#039; exercizing our right to express this anger first, before you preach the gospel of jollyness from on high, especially when it originates from someone who has a need to follow his name with a string of qualifications (e.g.TE, PTP, AICP, MPA ).Puffery does not belong here.

In the USA we have a habit of starting from square one instead of seeking out long established protocols in other parts of the world, evaluating their successes and applying them to our particular situations.We prefer, self centred as we are, to stumble along and, inevitably achieve far from adequate results. I offer as one significant example, the use of industrial sized wind turbines for electricity generation when 30 years of experience in Germany has brought them around to the realization that this source of power generation cannot even come close to realizing the goals required. Any intelligent person or group subsequently trying to initiate a response to the climate change issue would be wise to use the end point of Germany&#039;s experience as their starting point instead of which it is our arrogant choice to go back to the stone age and &#039;re-invent the wheel.&#039; Pride is the issue here.

The first thing the engineering community and politicians need to do is invite expression of the cycling community&#039;s feelings without trying to water it down and, honestly and openly, they need to hear and acknowledge the anger and it&#039;s sources. Otherwise what the political anfd engineering powers that be will end up imposing designs which do not necessarily meet the needs and aspirations of the cycling public.

Listening to and hearing how we feel about our experiences is, categorically, critical. All I see in this letter is a wordy attempt to squash the real feelings of the cycling public so it feels comfortable for the engineers and politicians. Describing conferencees as &#039;shrill&#039; is insulting. What needs to be recognized is the level of anger,fear and frustration we feel as cyclists, people with basically similar goals as other travellers yet who have to endure far from acceptable transportation environments, ones which we have little or no voice in establishing.

I recently approached a local mall manager about having cycle racks available and was met with &quot;We don&#039;t have many people cycling to the mall !&quot;. This in a situation where access to the mall is either legally banned or requires a lengthy, circuitous detour. His response reflects much of the present attitude to cycling as a means of transportation and subsequent need to make accomodations. Another mall, after being lobbied for years, provided an excellent bike rack for 5 bicycles (this in the middle of the city) and then proceeded to ignore/not monitor the problems that arose when emptied shopping carts continuously blocked access.

Without belaboring the details, of which there are a multitude, all I am wishing to establish is that &#039;A car is a machine used in transporting a human and so is a bicycle !&quot;. However, there are glaring differences such as; from a global warming situation the bicycle takes a fraction of the resources to build ; the cycle is propelled without the requirement of fossil fuels; the cycle acts as a continuous agent in form of health-giving exercize; the cycle requires a comparitively limited amount of parking area and, this age old device is a delight to ride, allowing much freedom and flexibility when the circumstances allow.

I urge future conferencees, both speakers to first encourage expression of what is driving these &#039;shrill &#039; attendees and  to do some serious listening. Attendees from the cycling community need to keep raising their voices until they establish an equal footing. We will not and should not &#039;come to the table&#039; until this is established.



]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As a cyclist who has seen how fellow bicycling humans are accomodated in countries such as Holland and Germany and compared that to the dismal, typically myopic, North American approach have a long established reservoir of anger. So you will have to endure my and others&#8217; exercizing our right to express this anger first, before you preach the gospel of jollyness from on high, especially when it originates from someone who has a need to follow his name with a string of qualifications (e.g.TE, PTP, AICP, MPA ).Puffery does not belong here.</p>
<p>In the USA we have a habit of starting from square one instead of seeking out long established protocols in other parts of the world, evaluating their successes and applying them to our particular situations.We prefer, self centred as we are, to stumble along and, inevitably achieve far from adequate results. I offer as one significant example, the use of industrial sized wind turbines for electricity generation when 30 years of experience in Germany has brought them around to the realization that this source of power generation cannot even come close to realizing the goals required. Any intelligent person or group subsequently trying to initiate a response to the climate change issue would be wise to use the end point of Germany&#8217;s experience as their starting point instead of which it is our arrogant choice to go back to the stone age and &#8216;re-invent the wheel.&#8217; Pride is the issue here.</p>
<p>The first thing the engineering community and politicians need to do is invite expression of the cycling community&#8217;s feelings without trying to water it down and, honestly and openly, they need to hear and acknowledge the anger and it&#8217;s sources. Otherwise what the political anfd engineering powers that be will end up imposing designs which do not necessarily meet the needs and aspirations of the cycling public.</p>
<p>Listening to and hearing how we feel about our experiences is, categorically, critical. All I see in this letter is a wordy attempt to squash the real feelings of the cycling public so it feels comfortable for the engineers and politicians. Describing conferencees as &#8216;shrill&#8217; is insulting. What needs to be recognized is the level of anger,fear and frustration we feel as cyclists, people with basically similar goals as other travellers yet who have to endure far from acceptable transportation environments, ones which we have little or no voice in establishing.</p>
<p>I recently approached a local mall manager about having cycle racks available and was met with &#8220;We don&#8217;t have many people cycling to the mall !&#8221;. This in a situation where access to the mall is either legally banned or requires a lengthy, circuitous detour. His response reflects much of the present attitude to cycling as a means of transportation and subsequent need to make accomodations. Another mall, after being lobbied for years, provided an excellent bike rack for 5 bicycles (this in the middle of the city) and then proceeded to ignore/not monitor the problems that arose when emptied shopping carts continuously blocked access.</p>
<p>Without belaboring the details, of which there are a multitude, all I am wishing to establish is that &#8216;A car is a machine used in transporting a human and so is a bicycle !&#8221;. However, there are glaring differences such as; from a global warming situation the bicycle takes a fraction of the resources to build ; the cycle is propelled without the requirement of fossil fuels; the cycle acts as a continuous agent in form of health-giving exercize; the cycle requires a comparitively limited amount of parking area and, this age old device is a delight to ride, allowing much freedom and flexibility when the circumstances allow.</p>
<p>I urge future conferencees, both speakers to first encourage expression of what is driving these &#8216;shrill &#8216; attendees and  to do some serious listening. Attendees from the cycling community need to keep raising their voices until they establish an equal footing. We will not and should not &#8216;come to the table&#8217; until this is established.</p>
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		<title>By: Bernie Paquette</title>
		<link>http://www.pps.org/blog/reflections-from-an-engineer-on-advocacy-for-transportation-reform/comment-page-1/#comment-97630</link>
		<dc:creator>Bernie Paquette</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Nov 2012 21:51:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pps.org/?p=79791#comment-97630</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Advocate not Alienate. Agree. Works when trying to inspire people to maintain a litter free environment as well as promoting complete streets.

Bernie Paquette
S.B. Vermont
http://litterwithastorytotell.blogspot.com/]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Advocate not Alienate. Agree. Works when trying to inspire people to maintain a litter free environment as well as promoting complete streets.</p>
<p>Bernie Paquette<br />
S.B. Vermont<br />
<a href="http://litterwithastorytotell.blogspot.com/" rel="nofollow">http://litterwithastorytotell.blogspot.com/</a></p>
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		<title>By: PaoloDesigner</title>
		<link>http://www.pps.org/blog/reflections-from-an-engineer-on-advocacy-for-transportation-reform/comment-page-1/#comment-97621</link>
		<dc:creator>PaoloDesigner</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Oct 2012 19:39:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pps.org/?p=79791#comment-97621</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I agree, all this bashing is not doing us any good.  Now, someone needs to make Fred Kent over at PPS understand that about his unchecked architect/professional designer bashing!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree, all this bashing is not doing us any good.  Now, someone needs to make Fred Kent over at PPS understand that about his unchecked architect/professional designer bashing!</p>
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		<title>By: John_Schubert</title>
		<link>http://www.pps.org/blog/reflections-from-an-engineer-on-advocacy-for-transportation-reform/comment-page-1/#comment-97620</link>
		<dc:creator>John_Schubert</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Oct 2012 19:08:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pps.org/?p=79791#comment-97620</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I did not attend this year&#039;s Pro Bike, but I sent a trusted source.  From his report, I think Gary&#039;s &quot;reflections&quot; are so diplomatically worded that many readers may miss the gravity of the underlying issues.
  As one anonymous commenter on this web page said, &quot;it is important to discuss history and learn from it at these meetings.&quot;  OK, so where was the presentation on the fact that &quot;coffin corner&quot; bike lanes and/or cycletracks (the mechanism of the collision is identical whether it&#039;s a bike lane or a cycle track) have caused so many fatal truck/bicycle collisions?  The deaths this year of Kathryn Rickson in Portland and two schoolchildren in Copenhagen should convince any remotely objective observer that the earlier deaths of Bryce Lewis, Brett Jarolemek, Tracy Sparling, Alice Swanson, and many others were not just freak accidents -- they were predictable in advance, and baked into the design.
  The hostility towards engineers (and towards anyone else who uses systematic failure analysis to learn from previous tragedies) is a sign of an extremist movement that has some serious problems.  As Richard Moeur said, government agencies have legitimate reason to be skeptical about using the public&#039;s money to send their employees to a conference that smacks of purging dissidents, suppressing critical thought and demanding ideological purity.  (The green fingernail polish was an ironic touch.  Rickson died because she trusted a green bike lane.)
  For the record, I have been a speaker and a sponsor at other Pro bike conferences spanning three decades.
  -- John Schubert, Limeport.org]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I did not attend this year&#8217;s Pro Bike, but I sent a trusted source.  From his report, I think Gary&#8217;s &#8220;reflections&#8221; are so diplomatically worded that many readers may miss the gravity of the underlying issues.<br />
  As one anonymous commenter on this web page said, &#8220;it is important to discuss history and learn from it at these meetings.&#8221;  OK, so where was the presentation on the fact that &#8220;coffin corner&#8221; bike lanes and/or cycletracks (the mechanism of the collision is identical whether it&#8217;s a bike lane or a cycle track) have caused so many fatal truck/bicycle collisions?  The deaths this year of Kathryn Rickson in Portland and two schoolchildren in Copenhagen should convince any remotely objective observer that the earlier deaths of Bryce Lewis, Brett Jarolemek, Tracy Sparling, Alice Swanson, and many others were not just freak accidents &#8212; they were predictable in advance, and baked into the design.<br />
  The hostility towards engineers (and towards anyone else who uses systematic failure analysis to learn from previous tragedies) is a sign of an extremist movement that has some serious problems.  As Richard Moeur said, government agencies have legitimate reason to be skeptical about using the public&#8217;s money to send their employees to a conference that smacks of purging dissidents, suppressing critical thought and demanding ideological purity.  (The green fingernail polish was an ironic touch.  Rickson died because she trusted a green bike lane.)<br />
  For the record, I have been a speaker and a sponsor at other Pro bike conferences spanning three decades.<br />
  &#8211; John Schubert, Limeport.org</p>
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		<title>By: Guest3</title>
		<link>http://www.pps.org/blog/reflections-from-an-engineer-on-advocacy-for-transportation-reform/comment-page-1/#comment-97616</link>
		<dc:creator>Guest3</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Oct 2012 01:38:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pps.org/?p=79791#comment-97616</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[There are a lot of engineers that &quot;get it&quot; and are working towards solutions. It took us over 70 years to get where we are today so the change throughout the nation will not occur over night. Start small and build up momentum. If we do not first succeed do not get discouraged but rather look for the opportunity of what can be done or agreed on and build up momentum. People naturally want to be part of success...so focus on the successes rather than the mistakes and people will gravitate to be part of the successful movement. Advocacy organizations should be highlighting those engineers and planners by name that &quot;get it&quot;...and helping tell their story and why, how, and what they have done.

When we talk about people based on their &quot;position&quot; we are not talking about a person but rather labeling them with a title and often a stereotype. Get to know those engineers on a personal level. They are often people just like you that live, work, and play in your community. They too have families and want a quality community.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There are a lot of engineers that &#8220;get it&#8221; and are working towards solutions. It took us over 70 years to get where we are today so the change throughout the nation will not occur over night. Start small and build up momentum. If we do not first succeed do not get discouraged but rather look for the opportunity of what can be done or agreed on and build up momentum. People naturally want to be part of success&#8230;so focus on the successes rather than the mistakes and people will gravitate to be part of the successful movement. Advocacy organizations should be highlighting those engineers and planners by name that &#8220;get it&#8221;&#8230;and helping tell their story and why, how, and what they have done.</p>
<p>When we talk about people based on their &#8220;position&#8221; we are not talking about a person but rather labeling them with a title and often a stereotype. Get to know those engineers on a personal level. They are often people just like you that live, work, and play in your community. They too have families and want a quality community.</p>
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		<title>By: Guest2</title>
		<link>http://www.pps.org/blog/reflections-from-an-engineer-on-advocacy-for-transportation-reform/comment-page-1/#comment-97615</link>
		<dc:creator>Guest2</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Oct 2012 01:29:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pps.org/?p=79791#comment-97615</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[In a review of many advocacy materials and approaches, there&#039;s a common theme of 
frustration and panicked urgency… and as a result with those tones, it often feels disingenuous and needlessly shrill. Should we make the conscious decision to 
return to a &quot;first things first&quot; approach where relationships are made and 
nurtured, I believe that earnestness radiates out and helps reduce that sense of 
distrust that many people seem to have for public sector employees like city traffic engineers, planners, as well as, advocates.

Starting out or nurturing a relationship does not need to include words or attacks that make people feel unwelcomed or blamed. That just closes peoples ears to listening and you lose your audience. That creates more walls and barriers rather than bridges to finding a solution. We do not need to rehash the past or what has not been done...but rather on the future and what we can do together. We should be highlighting the GREAT behaviors of those traffic engineers and transportation planners that &quot;get it&quot; and are doing great things. Celebrate it! Change the language, the converstations, and then the culture will follow.

I would disagree that advocacy is positive no matter what form it takes. The form can lose a lot of credibility and confidence with those that can help facilitate the change. The messaging, communication, and relationships need to be strategic. Advocacy groups should read the book &quot;Start with Why&quot; by Simon Sinek and then figure out the &quot;why&quot; that they share with those they are seeking help from...speak their language or what matters to them and it is amazing the synergy that will result.

As my mom used to say, you can catch a lot more flies with honey than vinegar. So if advocates really want to be heard and change to occur for the better, I would strongly encourage the use of honey.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In a review of many advocacy materials and approaches, there&#8217;s a common theme of<br />
frustration and panicked urgency… and as a result with those tones, it often feels disingenuous and needlessly shrill. Should we make the conscious decision to <br />
return to a &#8220;first things first&#8221; approach where relationships are made and<br />
nurtured, I believe that earnestness radiates out and helps reduce that sense of<br />
distrust that many people seem to have for public sector employees like city traffic engineers, planners, as well as, advocates.</p>
<p>Starting out or nurturing a relationship does not need to include words or attacks that make people feel unwelcomed or blamed. That just closes peoples ears to listening and you lose your audience. That creates more walls and barriers rather than bridges to finding a solution. We do not need to rehash the past or what has not been done&#8230;but rather on the future and what we can do together. We should be highlighting the GREAT behaviors of those traffic engineers and transportation planners that &#8220;get it&#8221; and are doing great things. Celebrate it! Change the language, the converstations, and then the culture will follow.</p>
<p>I would disagree that advocacy is positive no matter what form it takes. The form can lose a lot of credibility and confidence with those that can help facilitate the change. The messaging, communication, and relationships need to be strategic. Advocacy groups should read the book &#8220;Start with Why&#8221; by Simon Sinek and then figure out the &#8220;why&#8221; that they share with those they are seeking help from&#8230;speak their language or what matters to them and it is amazing the synergy that will result.</p>
<p>As my mom used to say, you can catch a lot more flies with honey than vinegar. So if advocates really want to be heard and change to occur for the better, I would strongly encourage the use of honey.</p>
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		<title>By: Guest</title>
		<link>http://www.pps.org/blog/reflections-from-an-engineer-on-advocacy-for-transportation-reform/comment-page-1/#comment-97610</link>
		<dc:creator>Guest</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Oct 2012 16:54:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pps.org/?p=79791#comment-97610</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Glad that Gary Toth published this letter, but I must say that ProBike-ProWalk is a meeting designed to help move forward in our thinking on biking and walking vs. spending a lot of time applauding ourselves.  So, it is important to discuss history and learn from it at these meetings.  There have been and still are barriers to improving conditions for biking and walking put up by some of these groups/organizations Bryan mentions.  That is just a fact. Instead of complaining about feeling unwelcomed or blamed, traffic engineers should be telling these people what they are doing today to improve things and accepting their feedback. Advocacy and civic engagement on any issue is positive in whatever form it takes. It educates us and broadens our discussions. We should welcome the opportunity to hear these refreshing perspectives with less defensiveness.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Glad that Gary Toth published this letter, but I must say that ProBike-ProWalk is a meeting designed to help move forward in our thinking on biking and walking vs. spending a lot of time applauding ourselves.  So, it is important to discuss history and learn from it at these meetings.  There have been and still are barriers to improving conditions for biking and walking put up by some of these groups/organizations Bryan mentions.  That is just a fact. Instead of complaining about feeling unwelcomed or blamed, traffic engineers should be telling these people what they are doing today to improve things and accepting their feedback. Advocacy and civic engagement on any issue is positive in whatever form it takes. It educates us and broadens our discussions. We should welcome the opportunity to hear these refreshing perspectives with less defensiveness.</p>
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		<title>By: Reflections From an Engineer on Advocacy for Transportation Reform &#124; keretterek</title>
		<link>http://www.pps.org/blog/reflections-from-an-engineer-on-advocacy-for-transportation-reform/comment-page-1/#comment-97607</link>
		<dc:creator>Reflections From an Engineer on Advocacy for Transportation Reform &#124; keretterek</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Oct 2012 20:52:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pps.org/?p=79791#comment-97607</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] was published by Gary Toth at the Project for Public Spaces&#8217;s blog. The letter partly refers to the venue but has a lot more between the lines. I might suggest that [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] was published by Gary Toth at the Project for Public Spaces&#8217;s blog. The letter partly refers to the venue but has a lot more between the lines. I might suggest that [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Jason</title>
		<link>http://www.pps.org/blog/reflections-from-an-engineer-on-advocacy-for-transportation-reform/comment-page-1/#comment-97606</link>
		<dc:creator>Jason</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Oct 2012 16:02:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pps.org/?p=79791#comment-97606</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Politics aside, we are all professionals and we need to acknowledge our mistakes. It is a shame that some Engineers feel as though they have been personally attacked.  But I have been unfairly pressured, dismissed and obstructed too many times by Engineers to have much sympathy.  ]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Politics aside, we are all professionals and we need to acknowledge our mistakes. It is a shame that some Engineers feel as though they have been personally attacked.  But I have been unfairly pressured, dismissed and obstructed too many times by Engineers to have much sympathy.  </p>
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		<title>By: Guest</title>
		<link>http://www.pps.org/blog/reflections-from-an-engineer-on-advocacy-for-transportation-reform/comment-page-1/#comment-97604</link>
		<dc:creator>Guest</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Oct 2012 04:09:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pps.org/?p=79791#comment-97604</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I am following up my comment earlier and want to echo Richard&#039;s thoughts.   It was a very well attended conference with some great content.  But if you are going to great lengths to make this conference a relevant meeting place for dialogue and for all transportation professionals, you have to cater to more than just activist advocates.  Again, that may be a deliberate choice by PPS and PWPB - but remember this is still a nascent movement, and growing movements need to be inclusive and willing to thoughtfully engage in dialogue, not shrill

I was honestly pretty unhappy with the actions at some of the lunch and closing plenarys.  Inviting John Horsley (head of AASHTO) and then embarassing him on stage - someone who is a bike advocate but leads a state membership organization whose membership is still growing warmer to bike/ped.  It&#039;s a hell of a lot harder for him to come to an conference like this than it is to have another feel good session by America Bikes or some other group.

And a closing speaker who proposed a ridiculous platform that included statements like &quot;WE NEED TO BUILD NO MORE NEW ROADS&quot;.  That may have made for good audience dynamics in the PWPB attendees, but I looked around and saw anyone that didn&#039;t work in advocacy shaking their head.  That plays well to your bike and ped advocates in your city, but try selling that to the average citizen. Or the City Council.  The city or state department of transportation. It&#039;s not a moderate or a realistic viewpoint and it sends a lot of advocates down the wrong path by proposing a more extreme, than collaborative method of doing things.

]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am following up my comment earlier and want to echo Richard&#8217;s thoughts.   It was a very well attended conference with some great content.  But if you are going to great lengths to make this conference a relevant meeting place for dialogue and for all transportation professionals, you have to cater to more than just activist advocates.  Again, that may be a deliberate choice by PPS and PWPB &#8211; but remember this is still a nascent movement, and growing movements need to be inclusive and willing to thoughtfully engage in dialogue, not shrill</p>
<p>I was honestly pretty unhappy with the actions at some of the lunch and closing plenarys.  Inviting John Horsley (head of AASHTO) and then embarassing him on stage &#8211; someone who is a bike advocate but leads a state membership organization whose membership is still growing warmer to bike/ped.  It&#8217;s a hell of a lot harder for him to come to an conference like this than it is to have another feel good session by America Bikes or some other group.</p>
<p>And a closing speaker who proposed a ridiculous platform that included statements like &#8220;WE NEED TO BUILD NO MORE NEW ROADS&#8221;.  That may have made for good audience dynamics in the PWPB attendees, but I looked around and saw anyone that didn&#8217;t work in advocacy shaking their head.  That plays well to your bike and ped advocates in your city, but try selling that to the average citizen. Or the City Council.  The city or state department of transportation. It&#8217;s not a moderate or a realistic viewpoint and it sends a lot of advocates down the wrong path by proposing a more extreme, than collaborative method of doing things.</p>
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		<title>By: PWPB Planner</title>
		<link>http://www.pps.org/blog/reflections-from-an-engineer-on-advocacy-for-transportation-reform/comment-page-1/#comment-97603</link>
		<dc:creator>PWPB Planner</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Oct 2012 02:38:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pps.org/?p=79791#comment-97603</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Bryan is 100% correct, the caddy and prejudicial proclamations were counterproductive at best and consciously ignorant at worst.

That said, you have to acknowledge reality.  Many of these advocates regularly experience small successes that prove hollow when megastructures insensitive to human scale and community context are pushed through the establishment anyway.

I was personally accosted at PWPB by an engineer when I critiqued a supposedly &quot;pedestrian friendly&quot; interchange treatment for being ignorant to empirical observation of desire lines and the minimum turning radii of the human body.  This engineer pointed out that the design had to be the way it was because this was the safest design according to published standards.  But how can a design be safe if 9 out of 10 users will behave in a way entirely different than the design intent?

There is a lot of personal and professional growth that all sides must undergo.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bryan is 100% correct, the caddy and prejudicial proclamations were counterproductive at best and consciously ignorant at worst.</p>
<p>That said, you have to acknowledge reality.  Many of these advocates regularly experience small successes that prove hollow when megastructures insensitive to human scale and community context are pushed through the establishment anyway.</p>
<p>I was personally accosted at PWPB by an engineer when I critiqued a supposedly &#8220;pedestrian friendly&#8221; interchange treatment for being ignorant to empirical observation of desire lines and the minimum turning radii of the human body.  This engineer pointed out that the design had to be the way it was because this was the safest design according to published standards.  But how can a design be safe if 9 out of 10 users will behave in a way entirely different than the design intent?</p>
<p>There is a lot of personal and professional growth that all sides must undergo.</p>
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		<title>By: Richard C. Moeur</title>
		<link>http://www.pps.org/blog/reflections-from-an-engineer-on-advocacy-for-transportation-reform/comment-page-1/#comment-97602</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard C. Moeur</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Oct 2012 01:49:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pps.org/?p=79791#comment-97602</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I was Bryan&#039;s co-presenter at our session at PWPB. The attendees at our session were interested, attentive, and polite, and the session went very well. No complaints there.

But in the weeks afterward, I also thought about the same issues as Bryan did. I certainly had no illusions about this conference - after attending 5 of them (and being verbally attacked by the attendees at at least one), I know that PWPB is of, by, and for the activist and advocate community, unlike ITE, AASHTO, or other technical meetings.

PPS/PWPB made very deliberate decisions in their choice of plenary &amp; keynote speakers, and had a very good idea as to what they might be expected to say to such an audience. Some, like Jim Sayer, were excellent. But given this, I wasn&#039;t very surprised at all to hear other high-profile speakers make extreme statements, such as laying the blame for our current situation directly on the shoulders of transportation engineering professionals, and that not providing certain facilities was a &quot;human rights violation&quot;. And the audience in general seemed to love every minute of it.

PPS/PWPB is free to structure their conference any way they see fit, and 800+ attendees is certainly not a mark of failure. But if I was a mid-to-high-level manager at an agency or transportation organization, and I was aware of the overall tone and content of some of the presentations, it would likely affect decisions on whether to send staff to future iterations of this conference.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was Bryan&#8217;s co-presenter at our session at PWPB. The attendees at our session were interested, attentive, and polite, and the session went very well. No complaints there.</p>
<p>But in the weeks afterward, I also thought about the same issues as Bryan did. I certainly had no illusions about this conference &#8211; after attending 5 of them (and being verbally attacked by the attendees at at least one), I know that PWPB is of, by, and for the activist and advocate community, unlike ITE, AASHTO, or other technical meetings.</p>
<p>PPS/PWPB made very deliberate decisions in their choice of plenary &amp; keynote speakers, and had a very good idea as to what they might be expected to say to such an audience. Some, like Jim Sayer, were excellent. But given this, I wasn&#8217;t very surprised at all to hear other high-profile speakers make extreme statements, such as laying the blame for our current situation directly on the shoulders of transportation engineering professionals, and that not providing certain facilities was a &#8220;human rights violation&#8221;. And the audience in general seemed to love every minute of it.</p>
<p>PPS/PWPB is free to structure their conference any way they see fit, and 800+ attendees is certainly not a mark of failure. But if I was a mid-to-high-level manager at an agency or transportation organization, and I was aware of the overall tone and content of some of the presentations, it would likely affect decisions on whether to send staff to future iterations of this conference.</p>
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		<title>By: Guest</title>
		<link>http://www.pps.org/blog/reflections-from-an-engineer-on-advocacy-for-transportation-reform/comment-page-1/#comment-97600</link>
		<dc:creator>Guest</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Oct 2012 22:51:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pps.org/?p=79791#comment-97600</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I couldn&#039;t agree more as a civil servant (not an advocate) attending Pro Walk/Pro Bike.  I am also a avid work, recreational and errand biker and I&#039;m (personally) an advocate for these two things outside of my professional work as well.  I care very much about both of these topics, and am a member of many of the organizations working on bike/ed issues.

Like Bryan, I was really disappointed with some of the tone of the advocates in the room, who didn&#039;t understand that decrying the present situation in harsh terms and cutting down organizations who you need as allies - not enemies - isn&#039;t helping the movement.  

 It&#039;s very, very easy to be an advocate, surround yourself with allies, and to choose the audience who you speak to.  It&#039;s harder to work inside an public organization (federal, state, or local) and push the sort of change you&#039;re espousing even if we believe in it.  It doesn&#039;t mean it doesnt happen but it takes a lot more effort and careful relationship building.  Angry advocates can undo in minutes what we have spent months or years to build momentum for change internally.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I couldn&#8217;t agree more as a civil servant (not an advocate) attending Pro Walk/Pro Bike.  I am also a avid work, recreational and errand biker and I&#8217;m (personally) an advocate for these two things outside of my professional work as well.  I care very much about both of these topics, and am a member of many of the organizations working on bike/ed issues.</p>
<p>Like Bryan, I was really disappointed with some of the tone of the advocates in the room, who didn&#8217;t understand that decrying the present situation in harsh terms and cutting down organizations who you need as allies &#8211; not enemies &#8211; isn&#8217;t helping the movement.  </p>
<p> It&#8217;s very, very easy to be an advocate, surround yourself with allies, and to choose the audience who you speak to.  It&#8217;s harder to work inside an public organization (federal, state, or local) and push the sort of change you&#8217;re espousing even if we believe in it.  It doesn&#8217;t mean it doesnt happen but it takes a lot more effort and careful relationship building.  Angry advocates can undo in minutes what we have spent months or years to build momentum for change internally.</p>
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